My 81-year-old mom has dementia and is narcissistic. Is anyone else dealing with this?

I’m an RN & have been one for 43 years. I can’t give you advice as an RN on this site but I can tell you as a daughter who will always be an RN too that I dispute your Sister’s opinion that your mother would die in a month in a Long Term Care Residence. People are initially unhappy...I don’t dispute that. But they are cared for well, you get your own life back & you need not feel ANY guilt. If your sister feels that strongly about your mother’s ongoing care, perhaps she would take her into her own home. My mother is doing just fine in a Residence. It is most unfair to judge or put guilt trips on any family member in this type of situation. In years of experience, I have never said those words to a single family member going through this kind of devastating situation. Having an elderly, difficult family member living with you is a choice, not a life sentence. You deserve a life too. You will become burned out & resentful if your caregiving affects your own life. Caregiving can affect your own health adversely. Please, no guilt. Your life is precious too. Live it! You can be supportive & caring while visiting mom at a Residence.

She drives her to two or three doctor appointments a year.

"My sister,an RN, told me that if she were put in assisted living she would die in a month." So just how is your sister the RN helping to support you in providing care for your mother?

That is an easy but simplistic solution. My mother HSS lived in the same home for 54 years. My sister,an RN, told me that if she were put in assisted living she would die in a month. I take care of her, she is yes cruel insulting loud demanding narcissistic and abrasive. But I have accepted it. I don't take it personally,rely heavily on friends and a terrific therapist. I have ms which she does not acknowledge because it would take attention away from her. I have given up the fantasy of moving her out because I know within 2 days she would be forced to leave, or, she would pass away. I don't want to carry guilt for the rest of my life.

Do NOT move an Elderly parent with Dementia, Narcisitic Personality Disorder or any other issue pertaining to this into your home! Don’t even think about it! Get help to find Residential Care for your parent. 

My mother too has a very controlling personality. She is never wrong & if I do try to enforce reality in any way, then I “break her heart” and am “constantly criticizing” her. Better to just keep quiet. She uses email like texts to communicate with my sister & I. My sister lives closer & sees her more often, so no matter what I do for her, my sister is the good one. I feel as though she hates me. But I keep visiting her once a week, have her numerous emails going to my “junk” folder so that I can ignore them until I am in a frame of mind that I can read them. She is a hypochondriac. Every day she has complaints. She falls often...never hurts herself despite being 88. It’s a ploy to get my sister or I to come to her place. She has always had a depression disorder. I grew up with that and as a child did not understand her hostility. As an Adult I do understand but she refuses help we have attempted to provide her with. I am sure she has some dementia but it will never be diagnosed as she refuses testing. She lives in a Retirement Res & has her meals provided as well as help if she falls & Nursing if required. She hates living there & blames my sister & I for “putting” her there, when in fact she agreed to move there due to many falls in her multi story house. It was a serious safety issue for her living alone in addition to being a nutritional issue in that she was unable to prepare her own meals. She was lying in a reclining chair all day then and still is today. She now has an electric wheelchair as her poor mobility became a fall issue as well. She is not social & does not attend any activities provided in the Retirement Residence even when we try to take her. Living with elderly abuse...the elderly abusing their adult children is very difficult. I get very depressed myself unless I can escape from her for awhile. I had a tough childhood with her & now my adult life is affected by her nasty behaviour. Counselling has explained things but nothing can help the way she treats me. It’s a fact of life I am learning to live with. I can’t walk away & leave my sister to deal with her alone. That would be just wrong. But to all of you out there going through the same misery, my most sincere compassion is with you. I wish I had some answers to help you deal effectively with situations that cause you such anxiety, hurt & helplessness but I don’t. All I can say is visit once a week, keep your visits short, send emails to your junk folder if they email & TRY to stay positive. These people live for negativity. You don’t need any more! And whatever you do, do NOT move them into your home!!! You need a safe, happy haven for yourself. It most certainly is not dropping the ball in ANY way to have a Residence provide the care your elderly parent may need. Your enjoyment of precious life may depend on it and you DO deserve some happiness! You will still have the complaints, negativity & pity parties to deal with but you CAN go home. Good luck!

Being in the same dwelling as someone with DEMENTIA Makes life seem so surreal, & nightmarish......... Prayer & The Holy Spirit is the ONLY WAY TO WIN HERE!! Don't become a liar because the disease pressures us into thinking it's better to lie to the afflicted
(just don't answer, if they don't know some has passed, then surely skipping past a topic )....Honestly The Devil is CLEARLY in the Details of the TREACHERY, UNAPPRECIATION, & LIES we are put thru when dealing with The Curse Of Dementia!!! WE ARE NOT EQUIPPED AS HUMAN BEING TO DEAL WITH THIS... WE RECOVER FROM HURRICANES 7 EARTHQUAKES.....But dealing with this withers us away..

I read the question and the answers from people who want to help. I have a question: If she is narccistic and mean, and she has dementia, what on earth are YOU doing to put up with this. When people are cruel and mean, even if it is due to dementia, YOU DO NOT HAVE TO PUT UP WITH IT. If your telling her to stop and behave does not end in a good result, then you MUST FIND A PLACE TO PUT HER. There is financial help and advice out there but regardless, you must remove yourself from her at once. YOU need to be able to live a normal life without this aggressiveness and problems she is dumping on you.

ufff... i so feel for you, and feel also it is an unsustainable situation.
my mother is demented and has fibrosos of her lungs and (from living with masses of birds in her living quaters) is a raging narcisist, messy, self flagellatingly resistant to medical help, completely unwilling to cooperate in her care, drinks incredible amounts of whisky, and very nasty to the females around her. i had kept a distance for many many years, with the occasional visit, but not getting involved in her web of intrigue and ever so familiar narcisistic behaviour. she is getting worse and worse, and i had to be around for a month, until a male caretaker was found she luckily accepts, and tell all her stories of how she was the most beautiful woman and so on. i have become redundant- thank god!- because i am not to be irked anymore. the list is endless... during this month my old anxiety came back, wich was my saviour in a way, because i took imidiate steps to again disengage. i only live 30km away, but i am not going near her. however her nastyness to the people around her do make me angry. i get therapy again to not feel responsible and protective of those people. no way do i owe her anything. that woman has made my life misery for many years, i am not obliged to be her playball. when we are compassionate persons that are responsible and helping we are easy targets to these personality disorders. and when, depcrepid as she is, she can hurl crystal clear abuse at my special needs brother about how disgusting he eats, it is difficult for him) even the slightest form of compassion i can have for her- flies out the window. with a stoney face i will go to her funeral, but that will be all. no- i do not owe her anything. we have to rid ourselves of the guilt. it is hard, but it is possible- i whish you strength to archieve it. bless!

Today my mother drove the caregiver to quit on the spot. Granted I don’t believe this caregiver was as skilled or experienced with dementia or understood narcissistic behavior either. My mother still lives on her own. It’s back to the drawing board, but this time it must be someone with experience with early dementia.

In the meantime I’m waiting on a pending job offer of my dreams and won’t afford her problems to impact my life any more. My biggest challenge is finding someone through IHSS who is available with experience. I’ve no family support and I live across the bridge from my mother, keep a safe distance  and rely on public transportation. My older brother, lives a few hours away, retired and seems emotionally checked out in helping me. I’m sure he’s had his own trauma to work through the dealings with her. He’s 67, 8 yrs older than me. She does have a kittie/companion who she claims keeps her alive. 

A few months ago her doctor spoke to me and said as the next of kin we should begin looking at long term options. Not immediately, but think of it. . I guess it’s that time. I do not want this to jeopardize my new job or my own wellness any more. Am I alone in feeling resentment?

And we all keep trying to please. We have to give up. We're never going to make a narcissistic individual happy. It's really our self concepts that are at issue here. Being a good person is not determined by whether we make Mom happy..... We have to change the source of our self concept. Mom does NOT make you ok.

Oh mertiloid,

Your remark about "killing yourself to save someone else" really hit home! Your mom sounds like mine, except mine is still living! Was your mom like that with everyone, or just you? My mom rejects every kindness, but she still wants me around to browbeat! Go figure.

Before we moved Mom to memory care, I stayed with her for several weeks while Dad was in the hospital with his own issues. While I was there I couldn't help but notice how dusty the house was getting; cobwebs in the corners, ceiling, and on top of the drapes; carpet stains, etc. All understandable since Mom and Dad, both in their late 80s had gone downhill over the previous few months. I didn't say anything about it but started cleaning the house top to bottom. Mom noticed me knocking down cobwebs, moving furniture away from the walls to vacuum underneath, washing baseboards, etc, all the little details I knew were to hard for her to deal with anymore. She gave the impression of being pleased.

Then, weeks later, Mom claimed I said her house was dirty and started doing things around the house without her authorization!

If I cooked, she refused to eat it, saying I was trying to take control of her kitchen. (Mom, with dementia, is incapable of cooking). If I brought food in, she refused to eat it, saying it was too expensive (even though she didn't have to pay for it).

Mom said she needed some new clothes. (She really didn't, but that's beside the point; I wanted to please her). I asked her to take everything out of her closet that needed a button sewn on, hems shortened or lengthened, split seams, taken in, taken out, what have you and pile them next to me to fix. She brought me enough that it took a full day of hand sewing to complete. Not a word of thanks.

She asked me to take her to the mall to go shopping for clothes. When we got there, she said everything was too expensive, even on sale. I took her to thrift stores but she couldn't find anything to suit her, so I started buying her things with my own money, bringing them to her to try on at memory care; even bringing her some of my own clothes I knew she liked. Nothing was ever quite right. I let hems down. I took hems up. I tapered the legs. You name it. The next time I 'd come to visit, she'd hand everything back, saying "These things didn't work for me; take them back."

She rejects my gifts. Once when I had taken her to a doctor's appointment, Mom pointed out a very expensive doll she admired in a magazine. She was quite taken with it. I made a note of it and managed to find the doll on eBay second hand. I was so excited, thinking how pleased Mom would be when I presented it to her. When I first gave it to her, she seemed pleased enough, but never mentioned the doll again. On the next visit, I found it put away at the top of her closet.

Just one thing after another. It took me awhile but I finally put 2 and 2 together. Dementia or no dementia, rejecting all my efforts is a power trip for Mom. She doesn't reject what others do for her; just me, because she blames me for what Alzheimer's disease has taken from her. She says I exert too much control over her life.

So I really understand where you're coming from, mertiloid. So exasperating. Mom seems able to accept gifts and kind gestures from others, not me. I just take care of the necessities, as needed.

Sounds like my parent,who is now passed.If i was happy,she'd find a way to upset me.If i fixed anything,she's smash it,If i bought her clothes,they didn't fit,...The juice had either "too much sugar",.. or "wasn't organic" The more I did,the more she expected.I was literally at her beck and call,...I cleaned her house every sunday,..did all the lawns and hedges,....pruning,...maintenance,... she scrutinized my every move.
Said the windows needed washing :/ It just got too much after awhile,..it was a damned if i did,and damned if i didn't..... after awhile my resentment grew into defending myself.. When i'd call her,..she's hang up most the time...or call me at times when she knew I was extremely busy....I was back and forth everyday for 2 years.It ages one,...it takes a very strong individual to endure the emotional and mental strain this takes on us.Like I mentioned before,...it's like killing yourself to save someone else.

Many thanks, SueC1957, for your helpful input. We won't have money to keep Mom in AL after her LTC money ends in a year and a half. I have read all of Cloud and Townsend's books on boundaries -- they are very good. They didn't really "take" in my earlier years -- I kept enabling my ex for way too long. I am re-reading them now and trying to really incorporate them. The house church of which I'm a part is good support, as is my counselor. I am 64 and overweight, but my health is pretty good at this point. Unless I can find an acceptable Medicaid-funded facility I don't perceive any options apart from early retirement and a move to KS from OH. I'm going to KS for Easter and have some appointments to look at some communities there, but I'm not optimistic.

Has anyone found acceptable Medicaid-funded communities for a loved one? My brother is in a very good group home in the KC-area, so I will not need to provide hands-on care for him. I do need to be there, however, to watch out for him. As wonderful as his staff is, they don't always understand when he tries to communicate to them. He's deaf and has CP -- none of them sign. When his gallbladder burst he almost died because no one understand the depth of his pain. I hope I'm right in thinking that I will be better able to understand him than is his staff. He and I are very close. My other sibs are both local, but my brother never sees our younger brother and my sister sees him an hour and a half a week. He loves that time, but it's not enough to keep an eye on things for him. I've promised my mom that I will be there to supervise his care when she's gone. So my early retirement and move are for both Mom and my brother.

I'm very grateful for the comfort I find on this site!

The only peace I have found in 5 plus years with 82 narcissist is other people! When the insults become brutal, the lackofgratitude is discouraging....I come on this site to remember I am not alone. It scares me a little selfishly that I am losing these years consumed by her needs.

Robin,
Her brain is broken. That's the reason.

Yes and its wearung me down. Antthing i do is wrong. Shes constantly caing me names tries to hit me at 93 she isnt hitting me that hard but its just the idea shes doing it for no reason.

My mom is 82 and living with my family now for just over a year. She has 50% hearing loss which adds to the dementia. In addition, when she gets cranky it’s usually from a urinary track infection. They don’t get infections that are noticeable like younger folks. Every day is a challenge. Patience is key. My mother who always her entire life, thought of only others is now the opposite. She is scared because she can no longer control her life. Her anger towards me is due to her lack of control and reliance on her daughter who she feels shouldn’t be her caregiver. She was most appreciative of me when she was in an assisted living facility. She could blame them instead of taking out her anger on me. Due to the rising cost of care, she is living with us again.

Teri,
Good for you on knowing that you need to start setting boundaries. People who don't set limits are always walked on, taken advantage of and "overused".

I'm guessing from your mom's age, you must be in your early 60's. Do you have any health issues? I'm 61 and am surprised to not be as "spry" as I was 40 years ago and have my share of infirmities.

If you have to move to take care of your disabled brother, I would strongly suggest NOT to add your mom to that mix. You not only will be 'fried' then 'burned out' but, in the end,  you'll be 'burnt and crispy'- body and brain. There is only so much one person can do.

Please don't count on the Lord taking your mom soon because she's near 88 years old. My mom is 95 and is still keeping' on in stage 6 Alzheimer's. Golden's mom is going to be 106 this year! No one knows how many years our loved ones have left.

Amazon sells this book; Boundaries by Henry Cloud and John Townsend ($10.)
amazon.com/Boundaries-Updated-Expanded-When-Control/dp/0310351804/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1518996313&sr=1-1&keywords=boundaries+by+cloud+and+townsend
It would help you set your limits before you get there.

You have to make sure that you are doing the most healthy things for YOU so you can take care of others and be well. IMO, I would keep Mom in the AL that she's "grown to love". It didn't work when I took my mom home from the memory care. She was used to the routine and wanted to be around more people than just me.

Good luck.

Oh, this is scary. My mom is somewhat narcissistic - more toward my sister than toward me. She's always enabled my two brothers. I'm the only one who is doing anything to provide care for her, but I live in Ohio and she is in KS. She's in AL now, but her LTC money will run out in a year and a half and I'm going to have to retire early, move to KS, and have her live with me. I've looked at medicaid-funded facilities and have found nothing that I consider acceptable. It was a huge battle just to get her to move from her house to an IL apartment and then another one to get her to move to AL. Of course, she loved both options once she moved. I have no delusions that it will be easy to have her move in with me, but hearing how several of you regret that decision scares me even more. I know that the Lord may take that decision out of my hands -- Mom is almost 88 now. I have to move to KS, anyway, as my little brother is severely disabled and he will need me. I have poor boundaries, so am working on strengthening those now.... Thanks for sharing your stories.

I share your pain, collector. My mom's narcissism has gotten much worse as her dementia has developed. Everything is all about her. The lack of ability to reason with her is tough. She can no longer see the logical connection between her actions and the money I then need to spend on her. When I try to explain it she cries because I'm making her feel back about not having money. She retired much too early, and gets only a small amount for SS as a result. I'm still working 60 hours a week and live 11 hours away. My sibs, who are local, do virtually nothing for her

Narcissistic Family Support Group
Caregivers of Narcissistic Family Members
I feel for you.
Diana

Meck, Interesting what you said about heavy metal toxicity. I have had the same thoughts and know as a dental assistant, mercury exposure as a young woman of 19 caused problems. I cannot take vaccines because most contain formaldehyde and mercury. Our elderly are vaccinated continuously. Makes one wonder.

Have you thought about getting in-home care for a couple of hours a day? Having another person there to take the responsibility from you and offer some "down-time" from caring for your mom might be worth the price. Best!

My personal requirements after many years in the life with an extreme narcissistic person, who also has other clustered personality disorders (histrionic PD and bipolar) can be especially difficult with the onstart of dementia. My best decision was to recently establish safe boundaries to keep me out of the abusive crossfire and enlisting my self care first. I now keep immediate family in the loop of major events and let the home care provider handle the day to day matters. It took some time to accept that I don’t have to feel guilt for letting go. 

Number2son,

Mom never had a formal diagnosis, but given her personality profile, she's the poster child for narcissism.

I never really understood it much until lately , I realize now my mom had this her whole life. It just show more with dementia, they don’t have the working brain to hide it as well. It is the Jezebel spirit. Google that and see if that sounds like your loved one. Narcissistic personality disorder, it’s spiritual warfare.

I can understand why lifelong narcissism gets worse with aging and/or dementia. With the mental decline, the cover falls away. What I find puzzling is why so many seniors develop such narcissistic behaviors. Total self-centeredness. No empathy for caregivers. Excessive demands, childishness, manipulation. What mental process fuels this attitude? Presenting with dementia, it's part of the disease. Why? Presenting without dementia, it still begs the same question. I know in the big picture, it really doesn't matter. It is what it is.

Still, it makes me wonder. We know a little bit of narcissism is normal. Too much isn't. What reading I've done on the cause of a narcissistic personality are two parenting extremes: excessive admiration and excessive criticism. What I don't understand is why narcissistic behavior shows up so frequently in the elderly when it wasn't present before. I never realized the extent of this disorder until I read so many accounts here.

I am the caregiver for an 82 year old narcissist. If I did not have friends and/or my support group, I would be lost. What is troubling is when we put and she will go on a very loud tirade - on purpose for attention - and strangers glare at me as though I am not helping her enough. Judgmental people never helped anyone...stay clear of them.

Only child of a narcissistic mother! She’s always been verbally and mentally abusive, I’ve never been good enough if it wasn’t what she wanted! Now her health has declined and has dementia which has enhanced her nastiness & she’s been sent to geriatric psych. I’m still the bad one who put her in there and of course some how a callous bitch (her words) because I wouldn’t rub her painful legs (they have open wounds!). I still sometimes feel like the child I was not wanting to upset her or disappoint her, however for her own safety and health, all i seem to do is make the wrong decisions and undermine her such as when she went looking for a wallet that she swore she had but it was at my house, & told her so and she freaked out swearing it was there.
Either way, she’s always been self centered and I know if i truly was a horrible daughter, I wouldn’t be traveling back and forth from Canada to NJ to over see her care and make sure she’s safe in the NH (which I’m awful for putting g her in).
I’m learning I’m not alone and I feel your emotional pain!